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Matthew 7:7-10 Ask and seek and knock gifts to children
1. Matthew 7:7-10 Verses
Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: [kjv]
αιτειτε και δοθησεται υμιν ζητειτε και ευρησετε κρουετε και ανοιγησεται υμιν [gnt]
7:8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. [kjv]
πας γαρ ο αιτων λαμβανει και ο ζητων ευρισκει και τω κρουοντι ανοιγησεται [gnt]
7:9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone? [kjv]
η τις εξ υμων ανθρωπος ον αιτησει ο υιος αυτου αρτον μη λιθον επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
7:10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent? [kjv]
η και ιχθυν αιτησει μη οφιν επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
2. Matthew 7:7-10 Ask and seek and knock gifts to children
The
ask,
seek and
knock model fits well for Matthew 7:9-11 and Luke (11:12) where Jesus talks about giving
good and/or
bad gifts to
children.
Ask: bread or stone (to get started, Matthew and Luke)
Seek: fish or serpent (snake) (for the journey, Matthew)
Knock: egg or scorpion (with possible surprise, Luke)
Since God and (evil) people give good gifts to their children, the following questions comes to mind. Who are the children? Who, then, would not give good gifts to their children?
3. ASK: ASK Seek Knock
The model that can be used is that of
ASK (ASK Seek Knock) from the verses in Matthew and Luke.
ASK is a
recursively defined acronym (of
infinite regress) where the following holds, using parentheses to show the expansion.
ASK =
(ASK Seek Knock) =
((ASK Seek Knock) Seek Knock) =
(((ASK Seek Knock) Seek Knock) Seek Knock) =
...
Some see this as cute without any useful meaning. The general approach here is that of a
string rewriting system (e.g., text formatter).
As one continues, one should be continually seeking His righteousness and knocking (in the Kingdom of Heaven) to see if others want to start the same path, until the final knock to the Kingdom of God.
4. Comments
Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: [kjv]
αιτειτε και δοθησεται υμιν ζητειτε και ευρησετε κρουετε και ανοιγησεται υμιν [gnt]
7:8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. [kjv]
πας γαρ ο αιτων λαμβανει και ο ζητων ευρισκει και τω κρουοντι ανοιγησεται [gnt]
In nearby verses, Jesus relates the
"ask",
"seek" and
"knock" sequence. The sequence is usually presented in just positive terms but the verses do not indicate that.
The ask appears to be a common decision on direction but the seek and knock can apply to both the narrow gate and wide area a few verses later.
5. Ask, seek and knock
Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: [kjv]
αιτειτε και δοθησεται υμιν ζητειτε και ευρησετε κρουετε και ανοιγησεται υμιν [gnt]
7:8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. [kjv]
πας γαρ ο αιτων λαμβανει και ο ζητων ευρισκει και τω κρουοντι ανοιγησεται [gnt]
The sequence
"ask",
"seek" and
"knock" appears many times in the
GNT (Greek New Testament), both explicitly and implicitly. What exactly is one
"asking" for,
"seeking" for, and
"knocking" at?
Jesus usually uses a
bottom-up forward-chaining process from start point to goal.
(start) "ask" then "seek" then "knock" (goal).
John often uses a
top-down backward-chaining process that leads from goal to start point.
(goal )"knock" if "seek" if "ask" (start).
6. Seeking and searching
In learning, one can search or seek knowledge. One must know that one needs to search or seek.
Matthew 6:33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you. [kjv]
ζητειτε δε πρωτον την βασιλειαν και την δικαιοσυνην αυτου και ταυτα παντα προστεθησεται υμιν [gnt]
In general, the following holds in computer science (and other areas).
A "search" is looking for something that may or may not exist.
A "seek" is looking for something that is known to exist, but the exact location of that something is not known.
7. Matthew 7:7 Reflexive interpretation
Jesus then immediately gives an example that illustrates a reflexive relationship. That is, a relationship that can refer to itself.
Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: [kjv]
αιτειτε και δοθησεται υμιν ζητειτε και ευρησετε κρουετε και ανοιγησεται υμιν [gnt]
As an intellectual exercise, consider the this verse in terms of reflexive relationships. Does it make any sense with respect to
reflexive relationships?
"ask" yourself
"seek" yourself
"knock" yourself
8. Matthew 7:7 Ask, seek and knock
Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: [kjv]
αιτειτε και δοθησεται υμιν ζητειτε και ευρησετε κρουετε και ανοιγησεται υμιν [gnt]
In this verse, the
"seek" appears to indicate that the goal is known to exist and is obtainable.
Have you ever heard or suspected that someone had interpreted the
"seek" as a "
search", as in "
searching" one's soul or self to "
find themselves" (as in a search)?
Does this make a difference?
[seek vs. search]
9. Matthew 7:7 Pearly gates
Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: [kjv]
αιτειτε και δοθησεται υμιν ζητειτε και ευρησετε κρουετε και ανοιγησεται υμιν [gnt]
Where (gate, area, etc.) should you be doing the following?
asking
seeking
knocking
 |
|
10. Ask, seek, knock
From the analysis of the parable of the sheep and goats, the
"ask" here could be the
"ask" of the
"ask",
"seek" and
"knock" in Matthew and Luke and that does not appear in John.
That could be as follows.
Ask to ask for the opportunity to be filled with righteousness and ask to seek righteousness and ask to knock to help others asking and seeking the same thing.
How about the following?
1. Ask for it. Ask to ask, a meta-ask (as in a meta-question).
2. Ask for it. Ask to seek.
3. Ask for it. Ask to knock.
This may be more precise from a logical point of view.
11. Matthew 7:7
KJV: Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:
Greek: αιτειτε και δοθησεται υμιν ζητειτε και ευρησετε κρουετε και ανοιγησεται υμιν
Latin: petite et dabitur vobis quaerite et invenietis pulsate et aperietur vobis
Wessex: Byddeð. & eow beoð ge-seald. secheð. & ge hit findeð. cnokieð. & eow beoð untynd.
Wycliffe: Axe ye, and it schal be youun to you; seke ye, and ye schulen fynde; knocke ye, and it schal be openyd to you.
Tyndale: Axe and it shalbe geven you. Seke and ye shall fynd. knocke and it shalbe opened vnto you.
Luther: Bittet, so wird euch gegeben; suchet, so werdet ihr finden; klopfet an, so wird euch aufgetan.
12. Matthew 7:8 Ask and take
Matthew 7:8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. [kjv]
πας γαρ ο αιτων λαμβανει και ο ζητων ευρισκει και τω κρουοντι ανοιγησεται [gnt]
13. Matthew 7:8
KJV: For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.
Greek: πας γαρ ο αιτων λαμβανει και ο ζητων ευρισκει και τω κρουοντι ανοιγησεται
14. Ask, seek and knock
Do we have the freedom to make the Bible say whatever we want it to say?
Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: [kjv]
αιτειτε και δοθησεται υμιν ζητειτε και ευρησετε κρουετε και ανοιγησεται υμιν [gnt]
In the context of Matthew 7, If one asks, seeks and knocks on the wide gate to destruction, it will open.
15. Luke 11:9-10
16. Luke 11:9
KJV: And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.
Greek: καγω υμιν λεγω αιτειτε και δοθησεται υμιν ζητειτε και ευρησετε κρουετε και ανοιγησεται υμιν
17. Luke 11:10
KJV: For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.
Greek: πας γαρ ο αιτων λαμβανει και ο ζητων ευρισκει και τω κρουοντι ανοιγησεται
This idea of ask, seek and knock is obvious in the book of John. Or is it? Let us look at a more general model of the "
anything" idea.
18. James 4:3
James 4:3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts. [kjv]
αιτειτε και ου λαμβανετε διοτι κακως αιτεισθε ινα εν ταις ηδοναις υμων δαπανησητε [gnt]
In the previous verse, they were
not "
asking". In this verse, they are "
asking"
badly. Is James saying that if we "
ask" in the
right way, we will get what we "
ask" for? What's the "
ask"?
The
KJV (King James Version) translates as
"amiss" a Greek word that means
"bad".
"κακῶς" ≈ "badly, miserably, maliciously" (as used here)
"κακός" ≈ "bad, ugly, wretched, mean" (related word)
These words are used by Jesus to refer to those who have fallen and need the Good News.
The ancient Greek word
"ἡδονή" ≈ "delight, pleasure, taste"and is the source of the English word
"hedonism".
19. Matthew 7:8
Matthew 7:8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. [kjv]
πας γαρ ο αιτων λαμβανει και ο ζητων ευρισκει και τω κρουοντι ανοιγησεται [gnt]
| * |
Masc.
Sing. |
Masc.
Plural |
Fem.
Sing. |
Fem.
Plural |
Neuter
Sing. |
Neuter
Plural |
| Nom. |
πᾶς |
πᾰ́ντες |
πᾶσᾰ |
πᾶσαι |
πᾶν |
πᾰ́ντᾰ |
| Gen. |
πᾰντός |
πᾰ́ντων |
πᾱ́σης |
πᾱσῶν |
πᾰντός |
πᾰ́ντων |
| Dat. |
́πᾰντῐ́ |
πᾶσῐ(ν) |
πᾱ́σῃ |
πᾱ́σαις |
́πᾰντῐ́ |
πᾶσῐ(ν) |
| Acc. |
πᾰ́ντᾰ |
πᾰ́ντᾰς |
πᾶν |
πᾱ́σᾱς |
πᾶσᾰν |
πᾰ́ντᾰ |
The ancient Greek word
"πᾶς" ≈ "all, every" (singular).
What might be the domain of this
"all"?
In the
singular, it is
"each",
"every",
"all" of the domain that fits the
context. That would be every man that exists in that domain.
In the
plural, this would be as a "
complete" unit. There may be exceptions.
Yogi Berra:
Nobody goes there (that nightclub). It's too crowded.
20. Matthew 7:6 Play on words
Matthew 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you. [kjv]
μη δωτε το αγιον τοις κυσιν μηδε βαλητε τους μαργαριτας υμων εμπροσθεν των χοιρων μηποτε καταπατησουσιν αυτους εν τοις ποσιν αυτων και στραφεντες ρηξωσιν υμας [gnt]
[monastery fumigation]
|
English: not give the holy the dogs/bird
Greek: μη δωτε το αγιον τοις κυσιν
Greek: μηποτε το αγιον ταις σχισιν
English: never (sarcastic) the holy the splits
|
The ancient Greek word
"κῐ́σσαιν" ≈ "jay bird" (dative) and
"κίσσα" ≈ "jay bird" or, in context,
"longing of pregnant women",
"craving for strange food".
21. Matthew 7:6 Play on words
Matthew 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you. [kjv]
μη δωτε το αγιον τοις κυσιν μηδε βαλητε τους μαργαριτας υμων εμπροσθεν των χοιρων μηποτε καταπατησουσιν αυτους εν τοις ποσιν αυτων και στραφεντες ρηξωσιν υμας [gnt]
Many play on words relate similar sounding letters, for example, the
omega "
ω" and
omicron "
ο" and
alpha "
α".
Non-verbal sides: To the
left are the oppressed disciples (sheep). To the
right (but a shadow) are the religious establishment (birds, pigs).
Some of these non-verbal directions were set up in previous verses (omitted).
22. Matthew 7:6 Paraphrase
Matthew 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you. [kjv]
μη δωτε το αγιον τοις κυσιν μηδε βαλητε τους μαργαριτας υμων εμπροσθεν των χοιρων μηποτε καταπατησουσιν αυτους εν τοις ποσιν αυτων και στραφεντες ρηξωσιν υμας [gnt]
| 7:6 |
to the left |
Do not give that which is holy [never a holy split] |
| 7:6 |
to the right |
to the dogs [bird] |
| 7:6 |
to the left |
Neither cast your pearls |
| 7:6 |
to the right |
in front of pigs [bad, hand] |
| 7:6 |
to the left |
lest [sarcastic] they trample them/you |
| 7:6 |
to the right |
under their feet and turn |
| 7:6 |
to the left |
andrend (rupture) you. |
The next few verses fit the
"or" form using the "
split".
(
7:7 7:8)
"or" (
7:9)
"or" (
7:10)
23. Matthew 7:7-8 Paraphrase
24. TenWordPin model for ask, seek, find
After the "
holy" "
split" one is in one of two positions from which one can
"ask",
"seek" and
"knock".
The two paths/ways of the "
holy" "
split" become clear through
non-verbal communication (hand movements, etc.).
7:7 Ask/given: 1. Left (sheep): TC 10 - no coveting
Seek/find: 5. TC 5 - keep Sabbath holy, bread, Holy Spirit, etc.
Knock/open: 8. TC 3 - keep name holy (path to God)
7:8 Ask/take: 4. Right (birds, pigs): TC 7 - no adultery (via measure, oaths)
Seek/find: 7. TC 7 - no killing, apostate church
Knock/open: 9. TC 2 - no idols, bowl judgments (dead end)
25. TenWordPin model for ask, seek, find
26. Matthew 7:9 Bread and stones
Matthew 7:9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone? [kjv]
η τις εξ υμων ανθρωπος ον αιτησει ο υιος αυτου αρτον μη λιθον επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
Even (oven) if this a half-baked idea, perhaps a
"stone" cold response to
"bread" could be forthcoming.
A pure-bread
"dog" might be called "
crusty".
Part of the
Eucharist is
"bread". If "
asked", would you deny a
"dog" who asks "
crumbs" for
"bread"?
If one is building a "
house" of "
sand" (human infrastructure) as in the "
temple" made of
"stones", then one could deceive and give, as a "
bad" "
gift",
"stones" to someone who is expecting
"bread" (of life).
27. Matthew 7:9
Matthew 7:9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone? [kjv]
η τις εξ υμων ανθρωπος ον αιτησει ο υιος αυτου αρτον μη λιθον επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
… panem … lapidem … [v]
… hlafes… stan. [wes]
… Brot… Stein … [lu]
… хлеба… камень… [rus]
The first type of gift appears to fit the
"ask" part of
"ask",
"seek" and
"knock".
28. The lord bred to loaf
Matthew 6:11 Give us this day our daily bread. [kjv]
τον αρτον ημων τον επιουσιον δος ημιν σημερον [gnt]
panem nostrum supersubstantialem … hodie [v]
… pan nuestro … cada … dánoslo … [es]
From the Old English, the word "
Lord" comes from the "
loaf protector" as in "
one who guards the loaves" from
"hlaf" (bread) and "
weard" (keeper or warder or guardian).
The word "
Lady" comes from the "
loaf kneader".
The Latin word
"panis" ≈ "bread" and is the source of the name of "
Panera Bread", literally "
Bread Bread".
29. Matthew 7:10
Matthew 7:10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent? [kjv]
η και ιχθυν αιτησει μη οφιν επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
… naeddren. [wes]
… edder… [wy]
… serpet… [ty]
The
modern Greek word
"φίδι" (FEE-thee) ≈ "snake" comes from the
ancient Greek word
"όφιν" (O-feen) ≈ "snake" where, over time, the leading «
ο» (omicron) disappeared (and the ending changed).
The Latin word
"serpentem" ≈ "snake" leads to the translation of "
serpent" for "
snake" in many translations.
The ancient Greek word
"ὀφείλω" ≈ "owe, be obligated" and is the word used in the Lord's Prayer. It can be a play on words with "
serpent".
30. Matthew 7:9
KJV: Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone?
Greek: η τις εστιν εξ υμων ανθρωπος ον εαν αιτηση αιτησει ο υιος αυτου αρτον μη λιθον επιδωσει αυτω
Latin: aut quis est ex vobis homo quem si petierit filius suus panem numquid lapidem porriget ei
Wessex: Hwilc man is of eow gyf his sune hym bit hlafes. selst þu him stan.
Wycliffe: What man of you is, that if his sone axe hym breed, whethir he wole take hym a stoon?
Luther: Welcher ist unter euch Menschen, so ihn sein Sohn bittet ums Brot, der ihm einen Stein biete?
Slavonic: Или кто есть от вас человек, егоже аще воспросит сын его хлеба, еда камень подаст ему?
Russian: Есть ли между вами такой человек, который, когда сын его попросит у него хлеба, подал бы ему камень?
31. Matthew 7:10
KJV: Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent?
Greek: η και εαν ιχθυν αιτηση αιτησει μη οφιν επιδωσει αυτω
Latin: aut si piscem petet numquid serpentem porriget ei
Wessex: Oððe gyf he him bit fissces. sylst þu him naeddren.
Wycliffe: Or if he axe fische, whether he wole take hym an edder?
Tyndale: Or if he axed fysshe wolde he proffer hym a serpet?
32. Bad gifts as good gifts
Matthew 7:9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone? [kjv]
η τις εξ υμων ανθρωπος ον αιτησει ο υιος αυτου αρτον μη λιθον επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
7:10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent? [kjv]
η και ιχθυν αιτησει μη οφιν επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
The second type of gift appears to fit the
"seek" part of
"ask",
"seek" and
"knock".
Who would give "bad" "gifts" to their "children"?
Would the religious establishment give "bad" "gifts" to their "children"?
Would the religious establishment,
deceptively, do any of the following?
☐ Who would make a
"stone" (big piece of "
sand", for a building, organization, etc.) look like the
"bread" of "
life"?
☐ Who would make a "
serpent" (Satan. Did God really say? You can be as a god.) look like a "
fish" (Christ)?
☐ Who would make a "
scorpion" (judgment) look like an "
egg" (life)?
33. Matthew 7:8-10 Disjunction
Matthew 7:8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. [kjv]
πας γαρ ο αιτων λαμβανει και ο ζητων ευρισκει και τω κρουοντι ανοιγησεται [gnt]
7:9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone? [kjv]
η τις εξ υμων ανθρωπος ον αιτησει ο υιος αυτου αρτον μη λιθον επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
7:10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent? [kjv]
η και ιχθυν αιτησει μη οφιν επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
The
disjunctions of
"or" would appear to indicate that these three verses should be taken together.
7:8 "or" 7:9 "or" 7:10
Notice that a number of words were added in the English while some words were not translated. In particular,
"μη" ≈ "not" is not translated. Why might that be the case?
The
TR (Textus Receptus) adds the two "
if" words and the "
is" word.
34. Romans 6:16 Either or
Romans 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness? [kjv]
ουκ οιδατε οτι ω παριστανετε εαυτους δουλους εις υπακοην δουλοι εστε ω υπακουετε ητοι αμαρτιας εις θανατον η υπακοης εις δικαιοσυνην [gnt]
There are some ways to express an either/or statement in Greek.
"ἤτοι" ≈ "either, or" ... "ἤ" ≈ "or" ...
This form does not appear to be applicable in Matthew 7:9-10.
35. Romans 6:16
KJV: Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Greek: ουκ οιδατε οτι ω παριστανετε εαυτους δουλους εις υπακοην δουλοι εστε ω υπακουετε ητοι αμαρτιας εις θανατον η υπακοης εις δικαιοσυνην
36. Strongs - which
*G3748 *145 ὅστις (hos'-tis) : hetis hay'-tis, and the neuter ho,ti hot'-ee from G3739 and G5100; which some, i.e. any that; also (definite) which same:--X and (they), (such) as, (they) that, in that they, what(-soever), whereas ye, (they) which, who(-soever). Compare G3754.
 |
Words: αιτινες=10 ατινα=4 ητις=38 οιτινες=60 οστις=26 οτου=7
|
The ancient Greek word
"ἥτις" ≈ "whoever, whichever" is the
feminine nominative singular of
"ὅστις" ≈ "whoever, whichever" (which can be a play on words). The word can replace
"τίς" ≈ "" or
"τι" ≈ "" when someone repeats a question (e.g., asked by another person).
37. Matthew 27:62
Matthew 27:62 Now the next day, that followed the day of the preparation, the chief priests and Pharisees came together unto Pilate, [kjv]
τη δε επαυριον ητις εστιν μετα την παρασκευην συνηχθησαν οι αρχιερεις και οι φαρισαιοι προς πιλατον [gnt]
The Greek word for "
day of the preparation" is
feminine.
The ancient Greek word
"ἥτις" ≈ "whoever, whichever" is the
feminine nominative singular of
"ὅστις" ≈ "whoever, whichever" (which can be a play on words). The word can replace
"τίς" ≈ "" or
"τι" ≈ "" when someone repeats a question (e.g., asked by another person).
38. Matthew 27:62
KJV: Now the next day, that followed the day of the preparation, the chief priests and Pharisees came together unto Pilate,
Greek: τη δε επαυριον ητις εστιν μετα την παρασκευην συνηχθησαν οι αρχιερεις και οι φαρισαιοι προς πιλατον
39. Matthew 24:24 Give a dose of deception
Matthew 24:24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. [kjv]
εγερθησονται γαρ ψευδοχριστοι και ψευδοπροφηται και δωσουσιν σημεια μεγαλα και τερατα ωστε πλανασθαι ει δυνατον και τους εκλεκτους [gnt]
The Greek word translated as
"show" is the ancient Greek word
"δώσουσι" ≈ "give, grant" which comes from
"δίδωμι" ≈ "give, grant". The word is related to
"δόσις" ≈ "giving, gift, dose of medicine" and is the source of the English word
"dose".
Might the
"elect" be giving a
"dose" of
"deception"? This
"dose" might be self-injected.
40. Matthew 7:7-10
41. Missing dog
Missing dog. If anyone sees her (Caesar), let us (lettuce) know.
Thanks a lot (salad). Before you toss it out, I already know that my salad jokes need addressing (a dressing). With a little care, it (caret) can be done. I love (olive) doing it. The hours are not good but the salary (celery) is great. Until then, I'll have to play it (plate) safe and leave (leaf) it alone.
Sermon analysis analogy: (perhaps from a PhD dissertation)
The group being asked is plural to show how many need to hear the message of the lost dog.
The dog is female to show the importance of females (diversity, inclusion, etc.).
The group asking is plural to show the importance of the group rather than the individual. Better (bitter) together!
What is the reality of the statement?
If the number of the group asking and being asked is not plural, and if the dog is not female, the play on words joke does not work! That is, the joke is Biffed. Example: If you see him let me know.
42. Matthew 7:9-10 Man
Matthew 7:9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone? [kjv]
η τις εξ υμων ανθρωπος ον αιτησει ο υιος αυτου αρτον μη λιθον επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
7:10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent? [kjv]
η και ιχθυν αιτησει μη οφιν επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
Greek (as it was actually stated): 1.
or who out of you (a) man whom ...
Greek (as it could have been stated): 2.
or who out of you who ...
Why is it a "man" as in #1 rather than just "you" in #2?
To make the play on words work, 3rd person singular is needed in order to use a play on words and use the ambiguous pronoun he/it in dative and/or genitive case.
"ὑμῶν" ≈ "you" as 2nd person, plural.
"επιδωσει" ≈ "give, grant" as 3rd person, singular.
"αὐτῷ" ≈ "him, it" as 3rd person, dative masculine/neuter singular can be ambiguous.
43. Strongs - give
*G1929 *10 ἐπιδίδωμι (ep-ee-did'-o-mee) : from G1909 and G1325; to give over (by hand or surrender):--deliver unto, give, let (+ (her drive)), offer.
 |
Words: επεδιδου επεδοθη επεδωκαν=2 επιδοντες επιδωσει=5
|
The ancient Greek word
"δίδωμι" ≈ "give, grant". The word is related to
"δόσις" ≈ "giving, gift, dose of medicine" and is the source of the English word
"dose".
A play on words of
"επιδωσει" ≈ "give, grant" appears to be with the ancient Greek word
"πτώση" ≈ "fallen, dropped" and is used by Jesus to refer, not to the destitute but to
"πτωχός" ≈ "beggar" as in those who need the "
Good News". Pause and take a deep breath before saying the Greek word.
Personal opinion: At this point, Matthew, who appears to have been writing down what Jesus says, may have looked to Jesus with a quizzical expression that said, "
How do I write that?". Jesus, without saying anything, points and wags his finger to say, "
Just write it down.". The result is word that does not fit either of the words exactly but does represent the sounds of what was said.
44. Usage - give
45. Eight-way pun
Here is a pun I created in the late 1980's using
3 words that each have
2 meanings.
Here are the 3 choices.
1. "you" or "a Jew"
2. "offense" or "a fence"
3. "roaming" or "Roman"
|
000
001
010
011
100
101
110
111
|
All
23 =
8 ways make some sense. In binary, we can see all
8 ways to have
3 choices with each choice being a
0 (zero) or a
1 (one).
One slides the pronunciation between each choice.
☐ Would
you take
offense to a
roaming shepherd?
☐ Would
you take
offense to a
Roman shepherd?
☐ Would
you take
a fence to a
roaming shepherd?
☐ Would
you take
a fence to a
Roman shepherd?
☐ Would
a Jew take
offense to a
roaming shepherd?
☐ Would
a Jew take
offense to a
Roman shepherd?
☐ Would
a Jew take
a fence to a
roaming shepherd?
☐ Would
a Jew take
a fence to a
Roman shepherd?
One might add more to this pun with "
defense" and "
the fence" or with "
rushing" and "
Russian", etc.
46. Matthew 7:10 Combinations
Matthew 7:10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent? [kjv]
η και ιχθυν αιτησει μη οφιν επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
Both verses end the same way.
επιδωσει αυτω (as written, to get the "spit out" or "fallen" idea)
επι δωσει αυτω (added space, to get legitimate words)
δωσει επι αυτω (word order change to get meaning, but loses the "spit-out" idea)
"δωσει" ≈ "give, allow" (3rd person singular future, subject as he/she/it not specified)
"αυτω" ≈ "him/it" (dative 3rd person singular, neuter or masculine)
There are no feminine nouns in close proximity to this statement. The
he/it can be the
"man", the "
son", the "
fish" or the "
serpent". The previous verse had "
bread" or
"stone".
The ancient Greek word
"επι" ≈ "on" has many related meanings and can take, as a preposition,
accusative,
dative or
genitive. This is great for play on word usage. In this verse, the preposition may refer to the dative
"him" or
"it" or might be understood from the non-verbal context.
47. Matthew 7:10
Matthew 7:10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent? [kjv]
η και ιχθυν αιτησει μη οφιν επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
Here are some possible combinations for the meaning of the last part of the verse. More than one may apply. The "
fish" and "
serpent" are assumed to not be the subject. No reflexive relations are used, though the idea of
"stone" "
on"
"stone" is used in Matthew 24.
| subject |
verb |
preposition |
dative |
question |
| ‑ |
δωσει |
επι (?) |
αυτω |
? |
| man |
will give/allow |
on (?) |
son |
? |
| son |
will give/allow |
on (?) |
man |
? |
| man |
will give/allow |
on (?) |
fish |
? |
| man |
will give/allow |
on (?) |
serpent |
? |
| son |
will give/allow |
on (?) |
fish |
? |
| son |
will give/allow |
on (?) |
serpent |
? |
48. Matthew 7:9-10 Take the fall
Matthew 7:9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone? [kjv]
η τις εξ υμων ανθρωπος ον αιτησει ο υιος αυτου αρτον μη λιθον επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
7:10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent? [kjv]
η και ιχθυν αιτησει μη οφιν επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
A slight inflection difference between the first
"give" with "
ο" (usual) to
"give" with "
ω" (unique) can change the meaning from
good to
not good.
Say the first part of each verse (to the left, pretending to eat, with a satisfied look).
Then, using "not": ... (he, the man) gives him, the son (what)? (to the right)
Play on words: ...(it, stone/serpent) falls/spits on him, the man? (to the right, pretending to eat and spits it out, with a horrified look of disgust)
[manna falls, stone falls, take (yourself only), take (from others), birds, kings, etc.]
49. Matthew 7:9-10 Play on words
Matthew 7:9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone? [kjv]
η τις εξ υμων ανθρωπος ον αιτησει ο υιος αυτου αρτον μη λιθον επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
7:10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent? [kjv]
η και ιχθυν αιτησει μη οφιν επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
Each part of each
"or" (good/bad) follows from the two ways to
"ask",
"seek" and
"knock" in 7:7-8.
The disciples indicate by hand motions, eye movements, etc., that they know what they should or would give their children.
The Greek word for "
right" as in "
right"
hand is a play on words with "
but a shadow". Jesus is setting up the observation and statement of the next few verses. These verses now make a lot more sense.
50. Paraphrase
51. Givers of gifts
This can be God giving good gifts.
This can be the (evil) world giving good gifts.
This can be human organizations giving bad gifts.
52. Luke
Luke 11:11 If a son shall ask bread of any of you that is a father, will he give him a stone? or if he ask a fish, will he for a fish give him a serpent? [kjv]
τινα δε εξ υμων τον πατερα αιτησει ο υιος ιχθυν μη αντι ιχθυος οφιν αυτω επιδωσει [gnt]
11:12 Or if he shall ask an egg, will he offer him a scorpion? [kjv]
η και αιτησει ωον επιδωσει αυτω σκορπιον [gnt]
In Luke, the
TR adds
"bread" and
"stone" and includes the "
egg" and "
scorpion" that is
not in Matthew. The
TR adds an "
if" and adds a
"not" in the second verse.
53. Luke 11:11
KJV: If a son shall ask bread of any of you that is a father, will he give him a stone? or if he ask a fish, will he for a fish give him a serpent?
Greek: τινα δε εξ υμων τον πατερα αιτησει ο υιος αρτον μη λιθον επιδωσει αυτω ει και ιχθυν ιχθυν μη αντι ιχθυος οφιν αυτω επιδωσει αυτω
54. Luke 11:12
KJV: Or if he shall ask an egg, will he offer him a scorpion?
Greek: η και εαν αιτηση αιτησει ωον μη επιδωσει αυτω σκορπιον
Latin: aut si petierit ovum numquid porriget illi scorpionem
Wessex: oððe gyf he hym bytt aig. segst þu raecd he him scorpionem þaet is an werm-kyn.
Wycliffe: or if he axe an eye, whether he schal a reche hym a scorpioun?
Tyndale: Or yf he axe an egge: wyll he offer him a scorpion?
Luther: oder so er um ein Ei bittet, der ihm einen Skorpion dafür biete?
Spanish: ¿O si le pide un huevo, le dará un escorpión?
55. Meaning
On the surface, these statements appear to lack significant logical meaning.
Those being evil, Jews, non-Jews, Christians, secular people, etc., give good gifts to their children.
The Father in heaven does so too, even more. That is nice.
If everyone does this, what then is the meaning? It can often as important as what is not said as to what is said? Who would not give good gifts but, instead, give the not good gifts? These declarative statements need some verses at the end of the chapter to complete the picture - the houses built on rock and on sand.
Those people in the human sand infrastructure are the ones that would not give good gifts to their "
children" as in followers, flock, etc. Examples include the Sadducees and Pharisees, and, later, many Christian church infrastructures (throughout the ages) who would rather take advantage of their flock than give them good gifts (or guidance or teaching, etc.).
56. End of page
Luke 11:9 And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you. [kjv]
καγω υμιν λεγω αιτειτε και δοθησεται υμιν ζητειτε και ευρησετε κρουετε και ανοιγησεται υμιν [gnt]
11:10 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. [kjv]
πας γαρ ο αιτων λαμβανει και ο ζητων ευρισκει και τω κρουοντι ανοιγησεται [gnt]
Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: [kjv]
αιτειτε και δοθησεται υμιν ζητειτε και ευρησετε κρουετε και ανοιγησεται υμιν [gnt]
7:8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. [kjv]
πας γαρ ο αιτων λαμβανει και ο ζητων ευρισκει και τω κρουοντι ανοιγησεται [gnt]
Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: [kjv]
αιτειτε και δοθησεται υμιν ζητειτε και ευρησετε κρουετε και ανοιγησεται υμιν [gnt]
7:8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. [kjv]
πας γαρ ο αιτων λαμβανει και ο ζητων ευρισκει και τω κρουοντι ανοιγησεται [gnt]
7:9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone? [kjv]
η τις εξ υμων ανθρωπος ον αιτησει ο υιος αυτου αρτον μη λιθον επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
7:10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent? [kjv]
η και ιχθυν αιτησει μη οφιν επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
Matthew 7:9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone? [kjv]
η τις εξ υμων ανθρωπος ον αιτησει ο υιος αυτου αρτον μη λιθον επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
7:10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent? [kjv]
η και ιχθυν αιτησει μη οφιν επιδωσει αυτω [gnt]
