Send Close Add comments: (status displays here)
Got it!  This site "creationpie.org" uses cookies. You consent to this by clicking on "Got it!" or by continuing to use this website.  Note: This appears on each machine/browser from which this site is accessed.
Sin and good people
by RS  admin@creationpie.org : 1024 x 640


1. Sin and good people

2. Romans 3:23 All have sinned
Verse routeRomans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; [kjv]
Verse routeπαντες γαρ ημαρτον και υστερουνται της δοξης του θεου [gnt]

Church of true Christians
If sinners were not allowed in church, there would be no one allowed in church.

The Greek here for "all" is plural which means there may be exceptions. Who might be an exception?
The ancient Greek word "ἁμαρτία""error, mistake, fault, sin" as in, literally, "not a witness". The Greek for "glory" is that of "opinion". Anything that is "not a witness" for God "falls short" or "lags behind" of God's "opinion" or "expectation".

In logical reasoning, one should not universally quantify something without specifying the domain to which it applies and how it applies. The "for all" would appear to refer to "men" who are not "God" (as in "Jesus").

Information sign More: A martyred witness to a translation error
Information sign More: Whether this or that: What is your opinion on glory?
Information sign More: Expectation of a glorious Greek opinion on a doxology
Paraphrase: For all have not been a (good) witness (of God) and not approached the opinion of God


Information sign More: Whether this or that: What is your opinion on glory?

3. Romans 3:23 Glory of God
Verse routeRomans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; [kjv]
Verse routeπαντες γαρ ημαρτον και υστερουνται της δοξης του θεου [gnt]

Do we need to come up to the "glory" of God? Perhaps a pastor could help us with that seemingly unattainable quest.
Paraphrase: All (with possible exceptions) have not been a (good) witness (for God) and have lagged behind the opinion/expectation of God.

It appears we do not have to reach the level of God. God has an expectation/opinion of where we should be and we are lagging behind that expectation/opinion. This appears to be in line with Eastern Orthodox thought.

Information sign More: Everything and all things: But wait, there's more

4. Sin and good people
Verse routeRomans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; [kjv]
Verse routeπαντες γαρ ημαρτον και υστερουνται της δοξης του θεου [gnt]
Verse routeomnes enim peccaveruntegent gloriam … [v]

Sins of the spiritIs everyone a sinner? Are people basically good?

The ancient Greek word "ἁμαρτία""error, mistake, fault, sin" as in, literally, "not a witness".

Can we make a complete list of all sins?

Does "all" mean "all"? Or does it depend on what the meaning of "is" is?

What does "short of the glory" mean?

5. Jeremiah 17:9 Heart
Verse routeJeremiah 17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it? [kjv]
Verse routeβαθεια η καρδια παρα παντα και ανθρωπος εστιν και τις γνωσεται αυτον [lxx]
Verse routecor … [v]
Verse routeherte … [wy]
Verse routeHerz … [lu]
Verse routeсердце … [rus]

Heart

6. Jeremiah 17:9
 All 
KJV: The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?
Hebrew: עקב הלב מכל ואנש הוא מי ידענו׃
Greek: βαθεια η καρδια παρα παντα και ανθρωπος εστιν και τις γνωσεται αυτον
Latin: pravum est cor omnium et inscrutabile quis cognoscet illud
Wycliffe: The herte of man is schrewid, and`may not be souyt; who schal knowe it?
Luther: Es ist das Herz ein trotzig und verzagt Ding; wer kann es ergründen?
Slavonic: Глубоко сердце (человеку) паче всех, и человек есть, и кто познает его?
Russian: Лукаво сердце человеческое более всего и крайне испорчено; кто узнает его?

7. Sinners
Verse routeRomans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; [kjv]
Verse routeπαντες γαρ ημαρτον και υστερουνται της δοξης του θεου [gnt]
Verse routeomnes enim peccaveruntegent gloriam … [v]

Church of true ChristiansEveryone is a sinner.

If sinners were not allowed into church, then there would be no one in church. Is this correct reasoning?
Are obvious public examples of sin to be tolerated? Tolerated as in ignored, condemned, promoted, participated in, etc.

What exactly is sin? Can a working/operational definition be provided?

Information sign More: Tu quoque or you too fallacy
Information sign More: Paradox lost: a way to tolerate paradise

8. Greek word for sin
The Greek word for sin is «αμαρτία», One can make the case that a "sin" is anything that is not a "witness" for God.

9. Negation by failure
In logical reasoning terms, this uses a "negation by failure" reasoning, common in logical programming and in human logic.

Negation by failure goes as follows: If one cannot prove something true it is assumed to be false.

If something cannot be shown to be a witness for God, then it is, by negation by failure reasoning, a sin.

Information sign More: Constraint logic: unification and resolution

10. Sin: decision analysis
A simple decision analysis has you making a decision, yes or no, and two ways another decision can go, yes or no.

Second decision
SinlessFor each outcome, a probability and cost is estimated. One often wants to minimize expected cost or maximize expected value.

11. Sin decision tree
 ▶ 
 + 
 - 
 1 First decision 
 2 Second decision 
 3 True positive: yes-yes 
 4 True negative: no-no 
 5 False positive: yes-no 
 6 False negative: no-yes 
 7 Complete decision tree 



The fundamental questions:

12. Second decision
Second decision

13. True positive
True positive

14. True negative
True negative

15. False positive
False positive

16. False negative
False negative

17. Complete tree
Complete decision tree

18. End of page

by RS  admin@creationpie.org : 1024 x 640