Matthew 16: Basket cases

Matthew 14:20

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KJV: And they did all eat, and were filled: and they took up of the fragments that remained twelve baskets full.

Greek: και εφαγον παντες και εχορτασθησαν και ηραν το περισσευον των κλασματων δωδεκα κοφινους πληρεις

Latin: et manducaverunt omnes et saturati sunt et tulerunt reliquias duodecim cofinos fragmentorum plenos

Matthew 15:37

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KJV: And they did all eat, and were filled: and they took up of the broken meat that was left seven baskets full.

Greek: και εφαγον παντες και εχορτασθησαν και ηραν το περισσευον των κλασματων ηραν επτα σπυριδας σφυριδας πληρεις

Latin: et comederunt omnes et saturati sunt et quod superfuit de fragmentis tulerunt septem sportas plenas

Matthew 14:20 And they did all eat, and were filled: and they took up of the fragments that remained twelve baskets full. [kjv]

και εφαγον παντες και εχορτασθησαν και ηραν το περισσευον των κλασματων δωδεκα κοφινους πληρεις [gnt]

15:37 And they did all eat, and were filled: and they took up of the broken meat that was left seven baskets full. [kjv]

και εφαγον παντες και εχορτασθησαν και το περισσευον των κλασματων ηραν επτα σφυριδας πληρεις [gnt]

A few years ago, a story went around and used by a number of pastors (I heard it more than once). The pastor would go to great effort to make a point that the "baskets" in the original Greek in the (one) parable were small lunch-sized boxes using a word related to the English word "coffin". They would go on to quote verses about not worrying about tomorrow and strongly hinting or saying that one should give the extra to the church (as tithe and offering).

*G2894 *6 κόφινος (kof'-ee-nos) : of uncertain derivation; a (small) basket:--basket.

Usage

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κοφινους *4

Matthew 14:20 ... of the fragments that remained twelve baskets full.
Matthew 16:9 ... of the five thousand, and how many baskets ye took up?
Mark 8:19 ... among five thousand, how many baskets full of fragments took ye up? ...
John 6:13 ... and filled twelve baskets with the fragments of the five ...

κοφινων

Mark 6:43 And they took up twelve baskets full of the fragments, and ...

κοφινοι

Luke 9:17 ... that remained to them twelve baskets.

*G2894 *6 κόφινος (kof'-ee-nos) : of uncertain derivation; a (small) basket:--basket.

Words: κοφινοι κοφινους=4 κοφινων

The ancient Greek word "κόφινος" ≈ "basket". This word was used in Latin as "cophinus" ≈ "hamper, basket" which is the source of the English word "coffin".

*G4711 *5 σπυρίς (spoo-rece') : from G4687 (as woven); a hamper or lunch-receptacle:--basket.

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σπυριδας *3

Matthew 15:37 ... of the broken meat that was left seven baskets full.
Matthew 16:10 ... of the four thousand, and how many baskets ye took up?
Mark 8:8 ... of the broken meat that was left seven baskets.

σπυριδων

Mark 8:20 ... among four thousand, how many baskets full of fragments took ye up? ...

σπυριδι

Acts 9:25 ... by the wall in a basket.

*G4711 *5 σπυρίς (spoo-rece') : from G4687 (as woven); a hamper or lunch-receptacle:--basket.

Words: σπυριδας=3 σπυριδι σπυριδων

The ancient Greek word "σπυρίς" ≈ "large basket" often used for provisions or to transport money.

Matthew 16:9 Do ye not yet understand, neither remember the five loaves of the five thousand, and how many baskets ye took up? [kjv]

ουπω νοειτε ουδε μνημονευετε τους πεντε αρτους των πεντακισχιλιων και ποσους κοφινους ελαβετε [gnt]

16:10 Neither the seven loaves of the four thousand, and how many baskets ye took up? [kjv]

ουδε τους επτα αρτους των τετρακισχιλιων και ποσας σφυριδας ελαβετε [gnt]

The pastors would completely ignore the other parable where the word for basket in Greek means a big basket as the basket into which Paul was placed to lower him from a window and wall to escape those plotting to get him.

One could argue that the word for "baskets" in Matthew appears in different chapters.

The distinction between the baskets appears again in Matthew 15.

Matthew 16:9 Do ye not yet understand, neither remember the five loaves of the five thousand, and how many baskets ye took up? [kjv]

ουπω νοειτε ουδε μνημονευετε τους πεντε αρτους των πεντακισχιλιων και ποσους κοφινους ελαβετε [gnt]

For the 5,000, which had just happened in the previous chapter, it was a "κόφινος" ≈ "basket". This word was used in Latin as "cophinus" ≈ "hamper, basket" which is the source of the English word "coffin".

Might the "blind" "feeding" of "bread" to people be a type of "coffin"? Jesus talks of this in John 6.

What does Jesus say here that might be in indication of "oppressive" "reasoning" on the part of the disciples (previous verses)?

More: Matthew 16:5-8 Big ideas connected with a little faith

More: John 6:53-61 Misinterpretation and the disappearing blood

Matthew 16:10 Neither the seven loaves of the four thousand, and how many baskets ye took up? [kjv]

ουδε τους επτα αρτους των τετρακισχιλιων και ποσας σφυριδας ελαβετε [gnt]

Jesus reminds the disciples of what had happened before. For the 4,000, it was a "basket" of the size that was used to let Paul down from a wall in Acts 9:24-25. The ancient Greek word "σπυρίς" ≈ "large basket" often used for provisions or to transport money.

How many "baskets" of money might have been taken up?

The word used by Jesus can be a play on words with a Greek word that means the onomatopoeic shrill sound of a "hammer" hitting metal.

What does Jesus say here that might be in indication of "oppressive" "reasoning" on the part of the disciples (previous verses)?

More: Matthew 16:5-8 Big ideas connected with a little faith

Matthew 16:9 Do ye not yet understand, neither remember the five loaves of the five thousand, and how many baskets ye took up? [kjv]

ουπω νοειτε ουδε μνημονευετε τους πεντε αρτους των πεντακισχιλιων και ποσους κοφινους ελαβετε [gnt]

16:10 Neither the seven loaves of the four thousand, and how many baskets ye took up? [kjv]

ουδε τους επτα αρτους των τετρακισχιλιων και ποσας σφυριδας ελαβετε [gnt]

After the service, I asked one pastor what theological point was to be made between the two in that the big baskets were for a crowd of four thousand and the small baskets were for a crowd of five thousand.

He had no answer and seemed irritated that I had even asked.

The same pastors will often say that if you have a question, please ask, but, when asked, that appears to not be what they really meant.

Matthew 16:9

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KJV: Do ye not yet understand, neither remember the five loaves of the five thousand, and how many baskets ye took up?

Greek: ουπω νοειτε ουδε μνημονευετε τους πεντε αρτους των πεντακισχιλιων και ποσους κοφινους ελαβετε

Matthew 16:10

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KJV: Neither the seven loaves of the four thousand, and how many baskets ye took up?

Greek: ουδε τους επτα αρτους των τετρακισχιλιων και ποσας σπυριδας σφυριδας ελαβετε

Acts 9:24 But their laying await was known of Saul. And they watched the gates day and night to kill him. [kjv]

εγνωσθη δε τω σαυλω η επιβουλη αυτων παρετηρουντο δε και τας πυλας ημερας τε και νυκτος οπως αυτον ανελωσιν [gnt]

9:25 Then the disciples took him by night, and let him down by the wall in a basket. [kjv]

λαβοντες δε οι μαθηται αυτου νυκτος δια του τειχους καθηκαν αυτον χαλασαντες εν σφυριδι [gnt]

The Greek word translated as "kill" is more that of "liquidate" or "dissolve" him.

The Greek word translated as "basket" is that of a big "basket".

Acts 9:24

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KJV: But their laying await was known of Saul. And they watched the gates day and night to kill him.

Greek: εγνωσθη δε τω σαυλω η επιβουλη αυτων παρετηρουν τε παρετηρουντο δε και τας πυλας ημερας τε και νυκτος οπως αυτον ανελωσιν

Acts 9:25

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KJV: Then the disciples took him by night, and let him down by the wall in a basket.

Greek: λαβοντες δε αυτον οι μαθηται αυτου νυκτος καθηκαν δια του τειχους καθηκαν αυτον χαλασαντες εν σπυριδι σφυριδι